Here we go again

Here we go again

Here we go again – another that is supposed to be on our side???

Dabar Yahuah Ministries Rebuttal of ‘Melkizedeq Teaching Error’
https://torahwithoutrabbinics.wordpress.com/2015/05/15/melkizedeq-teaching-error/
Torah without Rabbinic’s (TWR) email dated May 15 2015.

Please note: (This medium will not support colors)
Dave Perry in Black
Samual Thompson in Blue
** DP Answers
Melkizedeq Teaching Error
Posted on May 15, 2015
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Blk – In reviewing – It has come to my attention that Dabar Yahuah Ministries is in error in some of its teaching – 1st and foremost the Melkizedeq Feasts including Sabbath do stand and are incumbent on NT/NC Yahshua believers to observe and do.
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Blu – Not once have we stated anywhere in any article that we are NOT to observe the seventh day Shabbat, this is an outright lie.
As for the keeping of the feasts, we have presented the reasons from scripture why we believe these cannot be kept whilst in exile.
We do state that we are to remember these feasts that are in scripture please see the statement which explains indepth.
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** The point is Melkizedeq Feasts including/along with Sabbath; the Sabbath that you do observe – this is not an ‘outright lie’ but your misinterpretation rush to lashon ha rah judgment. I do acknowledge that you observe Sabbath but without the feasts like SDA, SDB, CoG7, etc. The point you and they miss is the Sabbath of the Covenant is only a Covenant Sabbath with all its other Covenant pieces including Feasts/App’td times (Ex.23/Lev.23) – The question is – Why do you even observe Sabbath since you are as you say “in exile”? What is your justification to observe Sabbath that you fail to extend to the App’td times of the same Covenant (Ex.19:5 thru 24:8)? What Yah in total calls ‘My Feasts’ (Lev.23/Ezk.20:24)!
And
Why do you even observe Sabbath? If you say it was before Sin, Jews, Hebrews, etc. at Gen.2:3 – then you seriously need to back up to ‘seasons’ @ Gen.1:14 it is the same Heb. word ‘mowed’ translated ‘feast’ @ Lev.23. The same logic applies!
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**You speak of ‘outright lies’ – The ‘find’ word search of the document “Statement concerning Shabbats & Feasts” ‘in depth’ or other wise reveals this as NOT so ie a lie as of 5.30.15 – @ “We do state that we are to remember these feasts that are in scripture please see the statement which explains indepth” – as stated this is not there; therefore Not true! – Even if this is just an oversite it still is confusing to others.
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Blu – 2Nd Dabar Yahuah Ministries believes that are at least “seventeen (17) different Calenders”, while there may be some abbreviated truth here; it remains that Yah has 1 Calender and that all these others are man’s (Jewish & Gentile) supposition and invention.
This is also a twisted statement what we have said is: Due to the many opinions on calendars and due to the fact that there are at least seventeen different calendars (Please see below) in usage today among Natsarym, Messianic and Jewish congregations and ministries, Dabar Yahuah Ministries believes that due to the at least seventeen (17) different Calenders that there is also at least seventeen (17) different year starts, seventeen (17) different weekly Sabbaths, seventeen (17) different new moon/month’s calculations and celebrations and also seventeen (17) different annual feasts dates throughout the year also.
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** You keep pitch’n your rant then try to twist the truth of my statement – Yah does only have 1 Calender and that all these others are man’s (Jewish & Gentile) supposition and invention. You say so yourself “Due to the many opinions on calendars and due to the fact that there are at least seventeen different calendars … Each group believes they are correct while the other sixteen (16) are wrong or incorrect.” The obvious leaving 1 as I have said!
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Blu – Each group believes they are correct while the other sixteen (16) are wrong or incorrect.
Please see: Statement on Feasts and Shabbats for a more correct rather than copy and pasted twisted spin that Dave Perry has presented.
Dave Perry states and I quote; it remains that Yah has 1 Calender and that all these others are man’s (Jewish & Gentile) supposition and invention.
We also put this (Dave Perrys) calendar into this statement:
Each group believes they are correct while the other sixteen (16) are wrong or incorrect.
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**@“Each group believes they are correct while the other sixteen (16) are wrong or incorrect.” – This is your statement you shoehorn in my mouth; to quote you – “this is an outright lie” in your own rebuttal about outright lies adding to others – That’s rich!
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Blu – With all due respect to Dave Perry and his one calendar, fact is there are at least 17 calendars in usage today, whether he or anyone accepts the fact he himself will condemn the other 16 Calenders as we have stated above, just have a look at his website for this.

Blu – 3Rd A Genesis Creation 24hr. Day is Evening to Evening – Not Morning to Morning or Morning only or ??? – Simply ask yourself – Which came 1st?; Dark or Light? – Hint Gen.1:2.
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** You make an all inclusive absolute statement “he himself will condemn the other 16 Calenders …” as if all others use a Morning to Morning or Morning only or ??? reckoning – This is short sighted and narrow minded – there are many other factors to consider.
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Blu – This is an old argument, interesting enough on one hand Dave Perry is condemning Jewish traditions when he himself upholds them. Dave Perry gets his Calendar from Nehemiah Gordon who is a Karaite Jew who does not accept Yahusha as Ha Mashyach nor the New Covenant, let alone any Malak-Tsadyq Priesthood.
Please see a full in-depth presentation on this subject of which answers Dave Perry’s Hint Genesis 1:2 argument: Please click here
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**@ ‘This is an old argument’ – Truth does not change! – Further – This is another quote you – “this is an outright lie” – and does not consider the Jews do have some truth – Karaite Jews are more honest – yet I do think for myself and compare any statement including yours to scripture. See TWR – https://torahwithoutrabbinics.wordpress.com/

** On your ‘When Does a Day Begin?’ you jade your comments and postulations to support yourself and your fanciful conclusions – suprize, suprize – Then you ignore what scripture actually evidences – like the #1 Gen. start – You state @“And Aluah saw the light that it was good; and Aluah divided the light from the darkness. Aluah called the light Day, and the darkness He called Night. Genesis 1:1-5”

**The same Darkness/Night that was already there “Genesis 1:1-5” – ??? That you conveniently ignore then twist to your own error conclusion.
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Blu – 4th “Acts 1:7 And He said to them, “It is not for you to know times (calendars) or seasons (feasts) which the Father has put in His own authority.
We (Dabar Yahuah Ministries) believe as Yahusha Ha Mashyach said that it is NOT for us to know the times i.e. calendars or seasons i.e. annual feasts …”
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A text taken out of context is a pretext – The context of Acts 1:7 is the question asked at Act 1:6 about the restoring of “… the kingdom to Israel?”
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Blu – Again this is his (Dave Perry’s) opinion the Hebrew word for Seasons is Muadah/Muadym and can mean feast/feasts, the Greek word for ‘time’ is Chronos and can mean ‘Fixed time’
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** Hellooo – This is Not my opinion – it is the context of the objective text – And it all has to go back to the Hebrew – The Mow’edim/App’td Time are fixed!
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The Torah reveals the App’td Times “the Father has put in His own authority” to do so. So it becomes apparent what YHWH wants us to know and those reserved to Him.
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Blu – 5th (quoting TWR) Dabar Yahuah Ministries is in as great of error as the Christian Church to use Hosea 2:11-13, Amos 5:21-27 and Isaiah 1:11-18 to state that “all the feast keeping, all the Sabbath keeping and all the new moons/months celebrations are all in vain.” because ‘your appointed feasts My soul hates’ – to mean YHWH hates His own Feasts???
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Blu – We would like to point out that IF (Which there is) at least 17 calendars this includes Dave Perry’s Karaite calendar approximately which one of these at least 17 feasts are correct?
Dave Perry will tell you his one is. However those who observe a Solar only or Lunar only or Solar-Lunar Calendar would believe and state that Dave Perry is in error and has the wrong calendar, this brothers and sisters is a fact.
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** “Dave Perry will tell you his one is…” this is your conjectured supposition – Your absurd ‘fact’ is in your own head – I do not even have a calendar; let alone Karaite – I go by scripture.
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Dabar Yahuah Ministries as well as the Christian Church including the Jewish assemblies need to realize that as soon as man pollutes any thing of Yahweh’s’s pure undefiled instructions that include His App’td Time Feasts; it becomes ‘YOUR’ pollution and is no longer His (YHWH) perfection.
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Blu – We are in full agreement with the part in this statement i.e. the part on pollution and as Dave Perry clearly shows he also has pollution in his calendar theory, or so say the other 16 different calendar observers’
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** “or so say the other 16 different calendar observers” including you and your obtuse reasoning – The very same can be said of you. There is only 1 truth – I’m just try’n to agree with what scripture says is Truth.
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There may be more that needs to be addressed – if so please bring it to my attention – The teaching of the Melkizedeq Priesthood is mostly unknown and just for that reason resisted for the most part when 1st encountered. The Melkizedeq Priesthood is already accused of being ‘pick&choose’; this is not so. However there are mitigating factors that must be fully understood that include Gen.1:1 thru Ex.24:8-11 being the Melkizedeq portion of ‘royal’ Torah. That include what Yahweh has said is ‘My Feasts’ at Lev.23; which is the extended form of Ex.23. We do not need more error taught by the well intentioned that have yet to fully grasp, understand or factor in Fully-Accounted-For-Truth (Acts 17:11).
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Blu – With all due respect Dave Perry does pick and chose’s his own theologies as well, one of the reasons we have come to the conclusions we have is because of Acts 17:11.
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**This is a reverse projection – You are the 1 who picks the Sabbath and chooses not to keep the Annual Sabbath Feasts. You do not discern correctly, you jump to not fully correct conclusions and make error assessments and statements not even realizing it while you deny and twist scripture (2Ptr.3:16) while you shoehorn stuff I never said. You are a total package winning piece of work! You are confused – deluded but convinced you are not and so confusing to others. You are still in a state of Spiritual Schizophrenic.
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While I do appreciate Dabar Yahuah Ministries having a certain heart for the Melkizedeq Priesthood message – I cannot abide or condone any group taking the occasion of the freedom afforded by the Melkizedeq Priesthood (Heb.7:12 – A reversion back to the Melkizedeq Priesthood Law standard) to teach any message that is error not being fully accounted for.
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Blu – We would also like to say while we do appreciate Torah Without Rabbinic’s (Dave Perry) has a tendency to cast judgement on other people and other ministries, only 5 days before he sent this email out he sent an email out endorsing Dabar Yahuah Ministries, please click here to see that email.
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** There is a difference btx ‘casting judgement’ and correctly assessing. This within 5 days of your posting the site – You added content – that I only later saw – You did before hand in Private Message ask questions expressing doubt – but when I explained your response was “I see what you mean” – There was no reason to doubt you were on board with all the feasts included – You can not be a ‘one new man/Mlkzdq/Covenant Keeper’ without them.
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Blu – Though we appreciate Dave Perry endorsing Dabar Yahuah Ministries, there is no need to, as Dabar Yahuah Ministries has been a blessing to so many throughout the world so really its not required.
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**As long as Dabar Yahuah Ministries holds to this church style/non-feast/Torahless – Non-Covenant position they are a conundrum of confusion and a detriment throughout the world. And a hindrance to the from Torah Melkizedeq Priesthood message.
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Blu – Please note that we have no intentions of removing any of Dave Perry’s teachings or books off Dabar Yahuah Ministries website.
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**Thankyou for that much.
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Blu – This rebuttal email is not to attack TWR or Dave Perry but to defend Dabar Yahuah Ministries and the incorrect statements made by TWR and Dave Perry.
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**Right back at you
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Blu – Shalum and may Yahuah bless you all.
Dabar Yahuah Ministries.
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**May Yah’s Word be our Guide

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5 thoughts on “Here we go again

  1. I always have a problem reading your constant conflicts because they are first of all, constant bickering, second of all, not very identifying on who is saying what…. on this one, there is no black nor blue and it is not very clear who is saying what. I hope that you follow Matt 18:15-18 . did you follow the second step? taking with you two witnesses?

  2. I’m on your side Dr. Perry….. we are to always correct but just do it in the proper way first and identify the text properly so that there are no further misinterpretations. – and ** are not always clear. best to state name then ” “.

    first person, Dr. Dave.

    second person , Dbar.

    like that..

  3. I read these pretty well. I think its great that you allow us to see people or ministries that go against the word teaching. However, i get the hebee. Jebee. when i hear anything Karaite Jews. I have researched this. They do not believe in Christ as yet. They believe (some of them, not all) that Jesus has to PROVE himself as Messiah (and can’t be done till he comes back). They are strict Lunar Sabbath teachers. Not only this, but the people i have met who say they are Kariate, are very rude, cuss like a freight train, have shown me dishonesty in their dealings and teachings in the chat rooms. (Case for Point, Samuel Taylor) I know he uses different names to start conversations to push that Kariate view, but I also know he blasphemed the Name of Jesus, and has no knowledge nor wants it, of the Holy Spirit and Trinity.
    You would probably say: “Well they are a word for word, as in read it simple for understanding”. That part i get. But i saw more out of this man, when i stated scripture dealing with his lack of knowledge on subjects. He became Vial, irritable, name calling, used the word Christian as a negative to any subject. I saw him deal dishonestly with people. I can never get that out of my mind. The Lunar sabbath (i admit) I am very unknowledgeable about, but starting to learn some in it….However i’m a strict believer in the evening to evening (making a day). That being said, I still like your honest enough to post rebuttals to the word and ministry. Your open about things, and i like that in a person committed to teaching the word.
    Thanks Dr. Perry

  4. Thanx – Don’t know of Karaite Lunar Sabbath leanings – Wouldn’t agree with it no how – It very much is a 2 edged sword – If you’re gonna deal with Righteousness – you’re gonna deal with un-Righteousness.

    Yah’s Esteem

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